Brock Sund, “future minister” and “devout Christian” extraordinaire, dropped me a comment that said:
Homosexuality or “being gay” (whatever it is you prefer) is a sin found in scripture (Leviticus 20:13).
Brock! The mystery is solved! I?ve discovered the basis of our disagreement: I?m reading Scripture … while you?re reading Scrapture!
Reading Scripture is difficult. It involves making an effort to understand the Bible?s verses in their historical, cultural, linguistic, and logical context. It requires consistency. It also requires a bit of homework and a lot of critical thinking, which is why reading the Scripture isn?t very popular with most “devout Christians” these days.
By contrast, reading Scrapture is absolutely effortless. Here are the steps:
1) Decide what you believe on a subject.
2) Find little “scraps” of Scripture that seem to support your beliefs
3) Remove these “Scraptures” from all context
4) Quote them as needed
5) Depend on other people to be too dull-witted to catch on to what you?re doing.
You?ve made a public claim that ?homosexuality … is a sin found in … Leviticus 20:13.? Here?s why this claim pegs you as someone reading Scrapture instead of Scripture:
1) Sin isn?t even mentioned in Leviticus 20:13. You may believe homosexuality is a sin, Brock ? but you didn?t get that belief from reading Leviticus 20:13.
Here?s the actual verse, from the dearly beloved King James Version:
If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.
Surprise! See? The word “sin” doesn?t even appear in Leviticus 20:13. That?s what you get for pulling a random Scrapture from a list of “Good Scraptures to Throw at The Gays!”
Once you start reading the Scriptures for yourself, Brock, you may discover that a lot of what you?ve been told is in the Bible simply isn?t there.
2) Leviticus 20:13 uses the word abomination. I know what you?re thinking: “Darn it! If I?d actually read that Scrapture before quoting it, I could have called Mark an abomination instead of just a sinner!”
Abomination! Oooh, very scary! I haven?t heard that word since they used it in the Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer animated special, when the Abominable Snowman appeared!
Exhibit A: The Abominable
Snowman.
According to the Levitical Holiness Code,
he’s ritually and ceremonially unclean.
So what does abomination mean? Well, where else is the word used in Scripture? Ah, here it is again, in the same chapter, verse 25:
Ye shall therefore put difference between clean beasts and unclean, and between unclean fowls and clean: and ye shall not make your souls abominable by beast, or by fowl, or by any manner of living thing that creepeth on the ground, which I have separated from you as unclean.
See that reference to ?unclean? fowls and animals? There?s a very long, very specific list of them in Leviticus 11, including rabbits, pigs, and shrimp. Just eating one of these animals “makes your soul abominable” — that is, makes you ritually and ceremonially unclean.
Ordered shrimp cocktail lately? Scarfed down some mu shu pork? Then, congratulations: we’re both abominations — because we?re both considered ceremonially unclean by the standard of the old Hebrew Holiness Code!
3) Leviticus 20:13 is just one itty-bitty scrap of the old Hebrew Holiness Code. Brock, as a reader of Scrapture, you?ve latched onto just one hunk of the Holiness Code — a series of instructions the Hebrews followed in order to stand apart from their neighbors and be considered ceremonially “clean.”
If you want to enforce Leviticus 20:13, you?ve got to embrace the entire Holiness Code, and you must:
– Never eat shrimp, pork, or any number of other animals (Leviticus 11)
– Never have sex with a woman who is having her period (Leviticus 18:19). (Editor’s Note: Being gay, that’s no problem for me!)
– Never steal (Leviticus 19:11)
– Never work one day and get paid on another (Leviticus 19:13)
– Never plant two kinds of seed in the same field (Leviticus 19:19)
– Never wear clothes made with two kinds of cloth (Leviticus 19:19)
– Never eat meat cooked rare to medium-well (Leviticus 19:26)
– Never shave your sideburns or trim your beard (Leviticus 19:27)
– Never get a tattoo (Leviticus 19:28)
– Always worship and never work on Saturday (Leviticus 19:30)
– Always stand when someone older than you enters a room (Leviticus 19:32)
The good news is, perhaps, that you will be able to have more than one wife — as long as you second wife is not a current wife?s sister (Leviticus 18:18).
So, Brock … you?re either serious about the Holiness Code, and keeping it all … or you?re selectively enforcing the parts of it that fit your agenda … which makes you a hypocrite and a bigot. Which is it?
4) Leviticus 20 prescribes the death penalty. Based on your own attitude toward Scrapture, Brock, I think you?re probably working with a church that likes to claim the Bible should be taken very literally.
So, Brock: do you or do you not support killing homosexuals? When your church discovers one of its members are gay … y’all do kill ’em, don’t ya?
But you can?t stop there. If you?re going to enforce part of the Holiness Code, you gotta enforce it all. As a result, you guys must be killing anyone and everyone who:
– swears at his father or mother (Leviticus 20:9)
– commits adultery (Leviticus 20:10).
– uses God?s name in vain (Leviticus 24:16)
– kills another person (Leviticus 24:17)
– works, travels far, or prepares a meal on a Saturday (Numbers 15)
At this rate, I guess there?s plenty of room in the pews over at your place, eh? Because you guys must be either enforcing the entire Holiness Code and putting all its punishments into practice …
… or when you made a reference to Leviticus 20:13, you were just quoting Scrapture: picking and choosing only the bits of the Scripture you felt supported a conclusion you had already reached, without regard for what the Bible really says.
Given this evidence of inconsistency and dishonesty, Brock, I feel compelled to ask you to answer three simple questions. Until these are answered, I?m not sure we can continue to study this issue together.
1) When you said Leviticus 20:13 teaches homosexuality is a sin, were you right or wrong?
2) When you cited Leviticus 20:13, did you embrace the entire Holiness Code … or did you hypocritically pull out just one small part of it that supports your agenda?
3) Earlier, you said, “To not preach and teach what the Bible says is to make the church a hypocritical society.” So, given the very literal death penalties outlined in Leviticus 20:13, does your church put all its homosexual, foul-mouthed, and adulterous members to death … or is your church a ?hypocritical society??
Brock, in asking these questions, my intention isn?t to be mean … it?s to get you to think ? really think! ? about the ways you and your church are using the Bible. Are you being consistent and honest … or not?
Are you reading Scripture ? or Scrapture?
I await your reply.
Very nicely put! Have you ever read “what the Bible really say about Homosexuality”? It was written by a professor of mine and brings up some of the same points you do, but in a more research type format! Would love to hear Brocks reply!
Mark,
First off thanks for the email, it showed that this can be a debate on beliefs rather than a personal argument. I never meant for that to happen, and i hope it didnt come across that way, i actually respect people that can back up their arguments it shows passion so i guess here is my answer to the three questions that you posted. Well first off i have to say that again i am not being judgemental on any specific sin or problem (abomination or whatever) i am simply saying that as part of the church we should want to hold each other accountable or how else can we grow and get better. Jesus corrected and told his disciples of their wrong doings and so must his church…. lovingly and respectfully. This growing is called SANCTIFICATION for those other than Mark as im sure he already knows that one.
1. I will still say that homosexuality is a sin, i dont care if the KJV says abomination and worthy of death. I myself think that “worthy of death” means spiritual death; you know that whole eternal hell thing which is reached by any sin NOT JUST HOMOSEXUALITY. I will also repeat in saying that no sin repented and cleansed by Christ’s blood is to much… (I hope not or im going to burn.) I am no closer to good or perfect than the next straight, gay, black, white, or blockbuster customer; we all need Jesus just the same.
2. In regards to the holiness code, yes i pulled out just one aspect but werent we just talking about one aspect. And of course i dont follow that code any better than the next guy but i have found that solution.
3. Of course not, (im not going to fall into that trap.) We do however preach that all sin is punishable by death(hell), do you agree? If so and if we also agree that all men are sinners, none is without sin not one; Where else would you want to be other than the church that teaches of ” THE WAY ” to TURN FROM (repent) your sin and have an opportunity at paradise.
In regards to the scrapture, which you defined as picking little “scraps” or scripture. I dont believe there are little scraps. Do you believe that all scripture is God Breathed, and written by God? If so to call any of it little scraps is kinda blasphemous ya think? I also dont take any context out of scripture and mold them around myself or my beliefs i simply take what they say and accept it as truth. I used to steal, drink, sleep around, do drugs, all that good stuff. Could i remodel scripture to where those sins didnt look so bad and make myself feel a little better. Sure! Could i justify them? sure i could because even though i dont do those things anymore i am still a terrible sinner and still have a sinful nature which constantly lies to me and tells me im a good guy. Scripture tells me otherwise. If we were good we wouldnt need a redeemer or savior, and i do.
In my final point (until next time.) Jesus said ” If anyone would come after me, he MUST deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow after me” Luke 9:23
Does this not mean that we should be willing to give up anything for Christ? Does this not mean that there is not any lifestyle, decision, sin, friendship, or anything that is above this command. True none of us follow this command or any other completely, but just because we are not perfect should we accept that and not try to be better…. NO. We must however look at ourselves and say am i willing to give up “—-” for Jesus? If we answer no, then hasnt that thing become a false idol? The last time i checked having false idols was a sin… right?
Mark i really do appreciate the opportunity to express my views on this page. I cant tell you how admirable it is of you to allow someone of such strong opposing views to continue speaking on your site. I hope this can continue for both the good of us and those reading this.
Brock